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Warnings of Bin Laden

If you’re tuned in to all the bulls**t coming from the whiners and the pacifiers here at home, please take a moment to read this blog entry from A Soldier’s Perspective.

I quote:

I personally saw, WITH MY OWN EYES, glorified paintings of planes hitting the WTC in Iraqi GOVERNMENT OFFICES. How many of you bought huge paintings of this atrocity and openly display it in your homes and offices?”

Read the whole thing. Then come argue with me that we’re doing the wrong thing. I’m happy to consider all reasonable points of view. Reasonable ends when your culture or government wants to annihalate a) my way of life or b) my life. That’s where war begins.

Hat tip to the Gunn Nutt.

Comments

CJ
Reply

Trevor, thanks for the linkage. Hey, I read in your info page that you’re libertarian. As odd as it may sound, I consider myself libertarian, though many libertarian views probably contradict my service, I don’t care.

I’ve read a few of your posts and bookmarked your site. Great reading. thanks.

Trevor
Reply

CJ – there are lots of varieties of libertarians, just like there are lots of types of bananas.

There is a schism in the Libertarian Party right now between hawks and doves – both sides have some meritable arguments. The doves think we brought this on ourselves, and in part, they’re right – the U.S. foreign policy over the last four decades has been entirely too interventionist.

However, when a person, group or government declares that their goal is to destroy my country, my family and my way of life, then it’s wholly justifiable to fight back with any means available.

Marinade Dave
Reply

Trevor-

You should read my post titled, “John W. Fountain,” from Aug. 16, and then read the comments. Go to his blog. I’d like your opinion on the guy.

Thanks,
Dave

Trevor
Reply

Dave, I left a comment on that entry, but I don’t see a link to John W. Fountain’s blog.

Kitanis
Reply

Well to chime in on what Trevor said, Iraq has made bristling comments towards the US since the Gulf War. The sad part of the equation is that the “doves” in this country are trying to trivalize anything the US does in Iraq or the middle east.

I am with the “CJ” at Soldiers Perspective. The MIG-29s burried was one thing. I’ll lay odds that there has been many things found in the country that the press will never be told.

To me the true problem is that the American Public were expecting a war to last maybe two weeks. I call it the MTV generation watching a movie.. short time.. then its over. But sadley the Iraq situation has not been like that.. Our mainstream press are all for pushing a anti-war agenda.. but Not truely supporting the troops who are involved in the mission of maintaining the security of Iraq while they hammer out their government.

Ah Well.. Keep up the fight everyone!

Marinade Dave
Reply

Trvor-

No, not a link to John W. Fountain’s blog. It’s the guy, Jamal, who left the first comment from that post. Click on his homepage and see what he has to say, or use this to get there: http://opinionated.blog-city.com/

I’m glad you liked the “Fishin’ with Frank” story.

Dave

jay
Reply

War begins when somebody attacks your government or way of life…not when they don’t like it.

Ya see…war is a serious thing. People get killed and lose body parts. It’s asking a lot to make young men go and do those things, especially when you’re not.

jamal
Reply

The view of a soldier just does not cut it for me. Peace and stability has not reigned supreme in Iraq. Civil unrest is worse then it ever was. The soldiers in Iraq do not even know why they are there as they are fighting for a cause that is intertwined with conspiricies and lies. If this soldier is so concerned, then why has he not gone to help in Sudan or elsewhere in the World where atrocities and violence are widespread?

BTW… im that samw Jamal. Ive just relocated my site to http://opinionated.blogsome.com/

Trevor
Reply

Jay and Jamal,

You’re certainly both entitled to your negative opinions of our current war.

I think you’re both somewhat niave though. The alternative to our offensive war is a defensive war. The whole peace thing isn’t an option, unless you have a magic pill that will wipe out the religious extremists that are perpetrating the violence.

It’s easy to criticize American government because you won’t get your head cut off for doing so. And to be fair, I agree that the people who direct wars should also be willing to fight them. But that’s a completely different issue. The war is still going to be fought either way – take a look at history.

Jamal, I think most of the soldiers in Iraq know exactly what they’re fighting for. Read their blogs, if you have a chance. Some are positive, some are negative, and some just discuss the facts of life as an American soldier in Iraq.

You ask why we haven’t gone to fight in Sudan? Think. The Sudanese are fighting mostly internally. Yes, it’s morally reprehensible that people are dying there. If you want to help, feel free, especially if you feel it’s part of your moral duty.

The U.S. cannot and should not try to solve every world conflict. We must act in our own best interest first. Sometimes it’s clear that we don’t. In the case of our invasion of Iraq, history has yet to decide. It will. No worries there.

jay
Reply

Not so niave as you may think, Trevor. I’ve seen war…very up close and personal. It’s an ugly business. I think most of the cheerleading for this war would change a great deal if the cheerleaders had to get into the game.

Trevor
Reply

Jay,

Sure, war is an ugly business. Have you seen the photos of what used to be living human beings who jumped off the World Trade Center buildings on 9/11? Ugly business. Have you watched the videos of human beings held down while their heads were sawed off with a rusty knife? Ugly business.

Those people aren’t going to leave us alone.

jay
Reply

Yeah, Trevor…I have. What does that have to do with invading Iraq?

Trevor
Reply

Jay,

If you have to ask, you obviously don’t believe what I believe. Which is that this war is essentially a battle between cultures.

One one side you have people who believe the world has room for different belief systems and that we should all be mostly tolerant of others.

On the other side are the head choppers, the murder bombers and the hate mongers.

You don’t have to like war, and if you did, I’d think something was not firing right in your brain. On the other hand, I think the anti-war crowd is a bit delusional. Let’s just end the war today, apologize to al-Zarqawi and ask him to stop killing people.

None of the anti-war folks I chat with have any realistic alternative solution to war, and none of them can explain how brining the troops home now will make things better.

Can you, Jay? I’m listening, and I’ll try to keep an open mind.

Jake
Reply

I think it is important to realize that Saddam was an evil man. He may have not been behind 9/11, i am still not for sure who was but that is a different subject the point I am trying to make is that Saddam murdered his own people with chemical weapons.

While I disagree with our foreign policy and believe that may have caused the problems we have now we are left to fix it. Our soldiers are not baby killers or murderers and while I disagree that they are defending my freedom I do agree they are defending the freedoms of the people of Iraq. I don’t believe it is our place but do believe that we are there and we may as well make the best of it. And also remember anyone who voted for Kerry voted for a candidate that supported the war he only became anti-war when anti-war became popular and I am not for nor against the war in Iraq. If I was president I would have probably not gone but I am not and won’t be for about 20 more years.

Thanks to anyone who is reading this that is in the military.

jamal
Reply

“You’re certainly both entitled to your negative opinions of our current war”

Well maybe if there was some significant range of positive alternatives trevor!

You said we must “We must act in our own best interest first”… if that by any means refers to Saddam Hussains 45 minute WMD threat… it was never proven. So that therefore asks the questions, in whose intrest is this War, and for whose benefit are these soldiers fighting?

If this war is due to “a battle between cultures” as you say, then that is not a good enough reason for mass slaughter on both sides.

I laugh at your statement of “On the other side are the head choppers, the murder bombers and the hate mongers”, because what do YOU have on YOUR side. Do the USA Army not kill, Bomb, slaughter, Lie and Torture??

Should all the Iraqui’s just end the War and apologise to GW Bush for invading them and slaughtering thousands of innocents based upon a lie and media propaganda?

By your posts, it is clear that you are unable to comprehend the arguments of anti-war folks as your own logic is biased and blinkered.

Trevor
Reply

Jamal,

Americans are certainly far from perfect. But as a society of people, in general, we do a much better job of protecting human life than the culture we are fighting does.

Yes, Americans mess up. But our official policy is to do our best to protect life. And I can’t speak officially for the U.S. Army, nor do I wish too. What I can tell you is this: I don’t lie and I don’t torture, nor would I tolerate it from my fellow troops.

Here is a little excerpt from Osama Bin Laden’s fatwah for you, Jamal.

The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies–civilians and military–is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty God, “and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together,” and “fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in God.”

Clear enough for you why I’m I volunteered to go to war? In the words of Osama Bin Ladan and like minded Muslims, this fight will last until there is no more tumult or oppression.

Maybe you should be complaining to them, not me. I didn’t start this fight and I have nothing against Muslims. I’m just not willing to sit around waiting for Ali bin-Psycho to come to my house with a present for me.

You’ve offered me no rational alternative to war. One-sided peace only works till the other side burns down your house and rapes your wife while forcing you to watch. Take a long hard look at history. Ask someone who survived World War II how well the efforts to placate Hitler went.

I’m biased, but I’m logically biased towards my own survival and well-being. I’d love it if we could all sing and dance and hold hands all the time and have a nice drum circle every night, but that’s not realistic when people are issuing fatwas urging other people to kill me, my countrymen and our allies.

Recipher
Reply

Always a heated topic. Trevor, there are many solutions, the most obvious lies in alternative energy resources. We have so many bright minds here in America that could help with this problem, but, it receives no support from the government AND the people. As you know, it’s our foreign policy that they hate. People complain about gas prices here, but, there is a reason why we get it cheaper than the majority of other countries.

After all of this, they don’t even want a democracy.

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/BAK263454.htm

But you, my friend, have taken up courage in strange times and I commend you for that. It’s just a vicious cycle that I think will get worse and worse, but, I hope it doesn’t.

Trevor
Reply

Just to be clear, Recipher, I don’t want a democracy either. I want a minarchist republic of sovereign city states. But we don’t always get what we want.

I hope the Iraqis grow up someday. There is some argument now among those drafting the constitution about whether they want strong or weak federal government. We did the same thing founding this country and the federalists won. I’m not sure that was a good thing. In fact, I lean the other way.

But I have to work within the reality I was born into and do my best to live with people. You’ll notice the Kurds are complaining about the situation? I think they would benefit the most from weak federalism and strong local government. Historically, they haven’t been treated well by the government of Iraq.

I can’t predict what will happen in Iraq, but I can do whatever small things I’m capable of to ensure that if the Iraqis want freedom they can find it.

Kate
Reply

Why do people insist on using September 11th to justify the war in Iraq? The “original” Osama Bin Laden is not in Iraq. Saddam once invited him to live there after he left Saudi Arabia, but Bin Laden declined.

Before the war, how many suicide bombs went off in Iraq? Now, it happens every day.

I don’t believe Saddam Hussein was ever Muslim enough for the Muslims. He was too westernized with his white suit and hat. Even though he paid money to suicide bombers in other countries, I don’t think they had a lot of respect for the man.

Before the war, how many people in Iraq were getting their heads cut off by terrorists?

As a result of the war, we have created a multitude of Iraqi terrorists and Iraqi suicide bombers. Terrorists all over can’t wait to leave their countries and go to Iraq to fight the infidels.

This war has created thousands of Osama Bin Ladens. But the one behind September 11th still roams free. Go figure.

Trevor
Reply

Kate,

The war didn’t create the thousands of Osama bin Ladens, it just helped them unleash their potentiality and move towards their “reward” from Allah more quickly.

The U.S. government does lots and lots of stuff that I disagree with every day. But I don’t start head chopping and bombing. I try to stay within a constructive framework.

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